When Christians are confronted with verses about slavery or women
being forced to marry their rapist, the
overwhelming response given for these verses is of course “you are taking it
out of context.” But when pressed to put it into context the common response
is, “we have to understand the culture”.
Let’s forget the fact
that a moral god would not be needed if the morals he is giving are based on the
cultures already present morality, as this is only evidence that man created god
in his image not a god creating man in his.
Let’s focus on the part where Christians say, “God lays out
rules specific to the culture.” (see post Short Conversation with Dr. JamesMerritt author of “God, I’ve Got A Question” to see this argument being used)
If God was real and sympathetic to our culture, He would
know we currently live in an information/scientific age, and that people who
are scientifically literate would not believe the claims of the Bible. God
would be aware that there are thousands of God claims and all of them require
people to use faith as justification for belief. So in order to avoid punishing
those who require evidence before believing things, since God cares about
culture He would update the world weekly on His YouTube channel on topics such
as gay marriage, who we should elect as president, why He is allowing African children to die of hunger, and the reason He sent a hurricane where He did that
week. These weekly updates would be aired on both the BBC World News and ABC’s
World News with Diane Sawyer. It would be crystal clear which God is the real
God no matter what country we are born in.
But we don’t see this today for either two reasons: 1) The
God who Christians worship does not care about culture - and slavery, stoning
misbehaving children, and forcing virgins to marry their rapist, etc. are moral
and should still be followed today. OR 2) God does not exists and was created
in order to explain things man didn’t understand and was a useful tool in
controlling ancient societies.
This has been a helpful site. I came here arguing for my faith and to test it, and much like Ted's story came away changed. My last statement here was something like, "you make logical arguments... but I don't agree with you..."... (yet)
ReplyDeleteThe ultimate argument boils down to faith. Faith can't be defeated in a debate. You have to be open to question it yourself. Looking into my faith, I found this. It's one thing to hold your faith in a world of people telling you that you are wrong. It's another thing to hold your faith against a world, supposively created by a supreme being, that itself tells you a different story then the one of your faith. Meaning that if you marvel at the sunset created in nature by God, how can you reject the fossil record (and other evidence) also created in nature by God? And if the evidence in creation itself is "cursed," then the rules of the game are far too difficult.
Faith in the Bible began when a group of people saw amazing supernatural events. If the story is truth, they had first hand evidence of seas parting and walls crumbling and even directly communicating with God. That isn't really faith. This was a point that jumped out at me as I was thinking this through after first coming here to test and defend faith.
You have made a difference.
Excellent point! I'm really glad you found this blog helpful. Do you remember how you came across it in the first place? I'd love to hear more about your transition... have you told your family/friends about losing your faith?
DeleteSure. After arguing here (I was looking for a place to test my faith as part of strengthening it, and I appreciated your civil approach) as a test... I did some research in places that are specificly directed at convincing one that God isn't real. And I did some research directed in proving God is real. Proof against remained consistant, while proof for varied depending on the defender. Like they were all just trying to rationalize scripture to fit with the facts on the ground. It seemed very strained. Some did a better job at rationalizing then others, but when you get into the seven days lasting billions of years, or the earth being created to appear old... you are just trying to make scripture fit what we now know about the world.
ReplyDeleteThe Bible itself though gave me a clue once I started looking at it based on evidence. The Hebrew people just saw, first hand, God part the seas and then drown the Egyptian army... and they start building a bull idol? A few generations removed from the event I could see, but that paticular group after what they saw? It doesn't make any sense. And in Egypt they all loved God and were waiting for the delivier, but in the wilderness they loved idols? Noting that along with the context of learning about the competition going on between various Gods in the region... the story began to make more sense in its motives.
Other things caught my attention, but after that, one day I decided to live without faith... and it wasn't any different then any other day. I realized I had probably had doubts deep down for a long time, because the transition hasn't been that difficult. It's funny. I had started the year with the goal of devoting myself more to my faith and studying Gods word. Half a year later, I'm learning some amazing things about the world I live in instead. Sorry, this is long.
I've discussed it with my wife a little. But mostly I'm just adjusting my lifestyle and I figure people will just notice. My parents and grandparents who may have had the most concern about it have passed away.
Sorry this response is so late, I remember reading this but not sure why I didn't respond at the time. Anyway, I was re reading this post and saw your comments again.
DeleteI just wanted to say I loved your point, "The Hebrew people just saw, first hand, God part the seas and then drown the Egyptian army... and they start building a bull idol?"
I've never thought about it that way before, it is just more evidence that god was a delusion to them and they were doing anything they could to try and make a bad situation better.